Events that have a separate Qualifying and Finals format
needs to be worded better / state what KEY differences are needed.
That is what led to me asking that big list of questions.
Headline: Inflation Takes WPPRverse by Storm.
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The top .01% of players own over 95% of WPPRs!!
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This just made me realize that one could, in theory, “go infinite” and qualify for worlds by only playing in Worlds…
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and after some does that then it will be time to make things like that not count for state points / not count for worlds points / etc
And now interest rates have to go up!
I’d gladly pay you Tuesday for a WPPR today.
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Definitely one of his better songs
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I’m sure it’s a total coincidence that WPPRs trended this way while certain IFPA leadership have become saddled with grownup responsibilities and can no longer play every podunk tourney.
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I been suggesting that for years.
Currently the tournament submission form has an option for “Match Play” in the finals format drop down. I assume that today that same option is being used for both “Group match play” and “Group knockout” (terms used by Matchplay.events). If “Matchplay Qualifying” is compatible with one of those flavors but not the other, then I’d suggest adding another item in that finals format drop down to differentiate.
Dave Peck asked me about the impact of 5.8 on his country.
Dave,
Countries like yours, Japan, etc. will be all but locked out of the top 100 within a year or so. As you know, the primary driver will be the number of events with 128+ players. Looking at past events and future plans, that leaves this:
Indisc
Texas
NYC
EPC
Fulda - 8 Olympics; two series per year, might change to 4 Certified+ at each series
District 82 - - likely to be 12 Certified plus events next year instead of the 20 or so regular ones this year
Chicago Expo
Brisbane Masters - 4 or 5 of their events
Swedish Champs
UK Classic
UK Open
Yegpin (Edmonton)
Pintastic New EnglandThere will be a second tier of “just certified” events like these unless attendance is able to rise:
Boras
Austria (3)
Finland
California Extreme
Dory Hill
UK League
Free Play Florida
Northwest Champs
Cle-Pin
I mostly looked at the last 6 months or so, plus ones I know about, may have missed a few. But there’s a Triple Whammy on all of this: Players in these events will and already have moved up in the rankings, so those events become even more valuable due to strength of field (TPA). One big feedback loop. Anyone who can’t get to a significant number of these will be playing for “halvesies or less” - - TGP of 1 to “just certified” vs. TGPs of 2 or 3 with certified plus; TPAs of much less; and also the way results scale - - 5th place out of 150 is a higher percentage of the #1 WPPR than 5th out of 64. It’s going to be brutal for locations without large player bases. When 64 was the max, it you had a medium-sized player base, you’re still at or close to full value and not too severely disadvantaged vs. the mega-events. Not any more.
After another year, people who attend a large number of these will have enough C+ events from 2023 on top of their more numerous but “only” high-base-value or regular certified ones from 2022 to pretty much fill out their top 20 cards. Everyone with frequent top-25 finishes at these will put them far ahead of most of the rest of the world.
I haven’t had time to do more precise math yet, but if you took the 2022 results and added on 2023 for the same venues but changing the events to C+ and having fewer of them in the cases of District 82 and Fulda, you’d get a good approximation.
People who are in “outer Europe”, much of the US (Florida / Arizona / Oregon / Colorado, i.e. anywhere other than the upper Midwest) and all outlying countries will have difficulty getting to more than two or three C+ events without a large expenditure. Texas: one, then 1000 miles to the next. CA - same. WA, OR - same. FL - none close by.
'Tis truly a shame for you and Dani.
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I’m just damn glad they removed the player requirement on Certified (the not-plus version)
I asked Bob to run the figures for me, in response to Josh requesting data in the International Directors forum. (I’m NZ country director, if you don’t know)
I know I’m pushing shit uphill even posting this here, because 90% of the guys posting here are taking full advantage of the WPPR farms. And hey - why wouldn’t you. I would too.
But the reality for us not near places like D82, we are all going backwards faster than forwards.
The proposed 400% boosters will make it considerably worse for most outside of the States. We simply can’t run tournaments of the size required. I ran a 3 day event here last week, I managed to get a credible 65 people to show up. From all over the country.
“Do it better” they’ll say, no doubt. I don’t think many could criticise how hard we try down here to make things happen. Population, crazy real estate prices (for venues) all play a factor.
Like I said, I don’t think I’ll get much traction here. 
But I’m just putting it forward so you guys get an idea of what’s happening outside of your sphere. I’ve got guys who don’t come anymore because they got disenfranchised with it all. “What’s the point?” One guy even suppressed himself.
“They’re playing for the wrong reason” they’ll say. People like the points. They like to challenge themselves. They like to improve. We don’t play for money - we have trophies and rankings.
The facts are - someone like Danielle Peck can never be #1 ranked Woman again, unless they up sticks and move to America.
Anyway … carry on.
Dave.
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State rankings matter to me a whole hell of a lot too. There’s nothing that’s worth a lot of points near me. I have to travel to every big event I want to play in.
But no matter how tiny the events are near me, every little bit helps towards my state ranking. That will always keep me and others coming back.
I’m just going to continue to play in, and run the types of events I like to participate in, and let the rankings fall where they may.
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Dave,
You can actually get most of the same Boosts that tourneys in the US can get, with the latest draft proposal that IFPA are contemplating: you can enjoy your base TGP of up to 200% for a weekend-long event, and you can get the Certified boost of 125% multiplied on that, regardless of # of players.
Here’s my summary of WPPR 5.8 as it stands right now…
Any event that has a separate Finals component (10-50% of the field) can now be graded up to 200% base TGP max (if 50 Meaningful Games Played). If no Finals, then 100% base TGP remains in place.
Boosts:
- Certified: 125%, with no requirement of # of players for Certified. See the new Certified criteria.
- Certified Plus (128+ players), and IFPA Championship Series (SCS, NACS, Pin-Masters, etc): 150%
- Major: 200%
So only Majors have the chance for 400%, and the only still-existing Major that will hit 400% is IFPA Worlds.
I made a Google sheet to show some of the estimated differences of types of events, comparing v5.8 to 5.7: WPPR 5.8 TGP Comparison Table - Google Sheets
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I added a line to my Google sheet comparing WPPR 5.8 to 5.7…
The SHPC will go from a 100% TGP event, to one that enjoys a 250% TGP level.
You easily meet the 200% base TGP, and in 5.8 you’ll enjoyed the Certified boost, because there is no minimum # of rated players needed to get the 125% Certified boost.
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Cheers for the reply Colin.
Yep … we have a couple of events a year we can get the boost for.
The issue is the quantity of those events smaller places can run.
Using the SHPC weekend as an example, there were 63 in the main event. Around 20 people travelled from 800-1200km away to make up those numbers. Unfortunately they can’t do that all the time. Couple of times a year is about it.
Compare that to the venues Stateside that will run 10-20 SHPCs per annum.
The people who can regularly attend all these huge events will enter into the “WPPR loop” that Bob mentioned. Hey - that’s a great t-shirt idea right there! “I’m in the WPPR loop!”
Hey - it comes down to population at the end of the day.
Dave.
Totally understand. Within 3.5 hours drive of me, I only have two large tourneys and one side tourney (the latter, I don’t play in, because of the time I have to spend organizing/TDing TPF). Used to have Bat City Open, but we lost the hosting location due to COVID. 
I have to fly across the country to get to larger, higher-value tourneys. And D82 is the logical choice for me, to get as many large tourneys in one long weekend as possible. Access to, and availability to participate at, locations like D82, Fulda, and Boras are a huge impact on the rankings. Undoubtedly.
Try living in Alberta, I had to build my own arcade so we could run a league and build a show YEGPIN so that we had at least one tournament a year for big WPPR. I have to travel in the US in order to maintain where I am at and now with D82 I may never get back into top 100 as that area is just too far to travel. I don’t get to play in my home show because it is so big now so I just have to kill it every time in my limited events… I feel your pain Dave…
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