All TDs. $22 for 12 small clocks. Easy to place near games. Start enforcing practice and between ball time limits so it is equal for everyone.
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but when the does the clock start? and stop?
also reset time for practice.
Joe. You get 2 minutes to get up to the game and start your 30 seconds of practice. You get 30 seconds from the time you plunge your ball for practice. Once the practice time is over, you reset and start your game immediately. If you haven’t plunged your ball in a short amount of time to start after practice, you can be DQed for the game.
State it clearly in the rules however you want and stick to it. Maybe allow one bathroom break per match to keep that simple.
Long story short, there are already rules in place so just enforce them and this all goes away. Look at the World Poker Tour, for so long, no one would call the clock on decisions because they did not want to be seen as an “asshole”. Now there are a hundred videos of people calling the clock on high level players because they are tired of this stuff.
The TD is responsible for the tournament rules and the players shouldn’t be put in a position to have to enforce the rules. Especially in these situations. At the World Championships, there was tons of chatter at the event and on the stream about the delay issues. The TDs choose not to take action and that is there call. They could have had to deal with a more hostile situation if one of the players called for a clock however that didn’t happen. This time….
Well when you have issues like login does not work right after an reboot.
and when you stuff like quick restart off some times you may want to reboot to get the game ready with out locked balls from practice.
Also when does an turn stop and start? for being on the clock?
The rules seem to have some in between time in some cases.
But when does an players turn start / end? vs may an differnt responsibility time for their turn?
If you are going to have an clock then you may need to define when an turn stops / ends.
Do want places getting more time from ask per the rules an TO to check the game for who turn it is now?
Also if an player is put on the clock can you now DQ them for out of turn or does that count as an TO saying it is your turn that will wipe out any out turn DQ?
If you want an clock then you need to define when an turn ends and then the next players turn starts. And you can’t just use the game as you are adding an responsibility part.
Also the IFPA rules do have rules that make for DEAD time / time an player is not allowed to play there ball and must have an TO make an ruling.
It doesn’t have to be that hard. Just set the rules and follow them.
Player one finishes their ball and drains. As they step away from the machine, they start the timer which is preset to 1 or 2 or 5 minutes (TD determined). Player two steps up and turns off the timer and plunges the ball. If the timers goes off before the ball is plunged or the player delays and step away from the machine after turning off the timer, get a warning. Second time is a yellow card. Third and subsequent time it’s a DQ for that game.
Obviously there has to be common sense about game issues or malfucation however this sets the general rules and avoid players taking a long time to start their ball every single time.
Did you watch the World Championship Stream? It was a consistent issue and games play long enough as it is. I bet we added over an hour to some of the matches with the machine just sitting there waiting for the next player to plunge and start their ball…
But in that case when an player starts the timer then next player can not be ruled out or turn right? even if the last player got some kind of ball save?
as it has been ruled before.
When you have an clock like that you are also more or less says that the player who was up has given up the responsibility of their turn? and to not only DQ the next player for out turn but let the 1st player keep the points does not seem like an good rule to have.
To put in an clock you also need to change the out of turn rules. And make not what the game says but also look at the case of the 1st more or less saying it’s your turn and the clock is on.
I’m done with this line of questioning and answers and I’m not debating any more.
Put it in the rules clearly and enforce however you want to do it. The key is the enforcement. If player one and two practice for 30 seconds and then player 3 practice for 2 minutes, now do the other get to go back up since the rule wasn’t enforced on player 3 and practice more… F that. You get 30 seconds and the timer goes off, you stop or get warning, then yellow, then DQ.
IMHO. On the next player timing, once a player drains a ball and steps away from the machine, the next player has 2 minutes to begin play or be plunged. It is that simple. Warning, yellow card, DQ game for every time after a yellow card is issued.
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Congrats to Jason Zahler …
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I congratulated Jason directly. Amazing player and legendary skills already. This still needs fixed. It’s not just him. There are people at league that make playing not fun. And yes, I have voted with my feet at most of them…. Hard to do that for majors and significant tournaments.
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Just be thankful people are not waiting 3 mins before their 30 seconds of practice to let the tilt settle.(Since most people end with a huge move to tilt).
Agreed. This is why having the ear bud mod on as many games as possible it critical.
At the “pro” level, even individual sports and games like bowling, golf, poker, bridge and chess have enforced times constraints. All were put in place to “keep things moving” as a courtesy to both other players and viewers. I’m all-in for a one minute max on starting your next ball, especially for games being played as single player or players 1 and 3 only.
As for practice, 30 seconds is too little, that’s why players regularly exceed it. I’d rather see you get 60 seconds before the first time you play a game, and none at all after that, rather than 30 seconds before each time you play it as is done now.
Speaking of practice, one specific issue is “finding the skill shot”. When that’s the primary objective of practice on a game, 30 seconds is bogus if the ball spends too much time rattling around after the plunge and or you have to tilt the game and maybe restart it to stop that. Maybe we need a “glass off” option for games like Supersonic - plunge, miss, grab ball, replunge. Maybe a posted cheat sheet: “first blue (usually) goes here, third red (usually) goes there.” Whatever, the current 30 second scheme is a bit too much of a crap shoot if enforced. I’m open to other ideas for how this can be improved.
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The problem with no practice after you have played the game would take another level of monitoring. Glass off would take longer to set up. Giving tips on the plunge is subjective and no way I would give that advantage away. Practice better, adjust better. Plunge, tilt, and plunge again instead of waiting for the ball to come down if it is that important to the game.
Honestly, since we had 90 minutes of practice time and many rounds of game, I think we should have went with zero practice time unless the game was modified or changed during the course of the event.
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but when you need an time keeper for each game?
along with an rule set for when the clock stops and starts?
also tracking the number of time outs?
And you also have the over lapping events rules that say you must wait.
Also with practice you also have reset time in between each player
You can’t get to practice on all 75 games in 90 minutes; maybe half if things go well. And yes, if you played a game during Qualifying, that should mean no practice on it in Finals unless significant changes were made.
a clock may replace an timer keeper but you still needs rules on when the clock stops and starts.
And you may need an some one do an video review on if they crossed an line or not before the clock hit’s zero.
Just a note and data point - I disagree. I think the earplug mod is detrimental to competitive play and am really glad to see that some of the higher level events have moved away from using them.
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I totally understand to a certain point. I think the earplug mod is fine and if not desired, just make the tilts a little tighter.
Just let players report significant delays to the tds. Then tds use that discretion to warn the players and give them the acceptable timing to come up and play their balls.
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