Tilt Pendulum / / digital

Yes, such a tilt pendulum is cult


it is considered to expand the times by a digital device

i think especially because of competitions - then a more exact adjustment could be made - the pendulum would not have to be set on the left, but could be set in the middle - and the adjustment could be set on the software side

should actually be possible, theoretically :wink:

what do you think about it? are you stuck on the pendulum? :smiley:

well the pendulum is cheaper.
as for software it can have it’s own but to interact with game states will need to somehow tap into game data and / or have taps into the switch matrix (even with that hard to get full game state)

Using an accelerometer would be a functional improvement for sure (more accurate, adjustable through software, etc.); however, there is no way the pinball world is ready for this yet. The cost isn’t significant for simple accelerometers… the cost would be in the changes necessary (software, manufacturing, etc) and the pushback on the idea of it.

I don’t think it is more accurate. I guess it about what you are measuring. And accelerometer would be very difficult to replicate the current device. We don’t just put a force threshold on the machine. I enjoy the technique involved with the current physical device and software implementation.

It is also pretty challenging to get it working well.

I realize I am one of those pinballboomers that you say would not accept this.

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While you’re right about the accuracy being dependent on what you are measuring… keep in mind what the actual point of the tilt-bob is supposed to be at the core. Also, any raw inputs from the sensor can be filtered, debounced, etc. appropriately to the application (i.e., measuring whether the manipulation of the cabinet is passing some set threshold deemed to be “too much”)

People are used to the idea of the tilt-bob swinging after a hard slap or nudge… and may even enjoy this as an important skillset, as well as attempting to move the pin in a certain way to minimize the impact. So, yeah… probably most people would think that disappearing would kind of suck.

If you were going to try to just emulate a physical tilt-bob, I think the entire exercise would make very little sense from a business perspective (though from an academic perspective would be super fun to work on).

Note that P3s has accelerometers in them. There are events exposed in the SDK.

They also have this, not that I value patents much. US Patent Application for Pinball Machine With Animated Playfield Components and Automatic Level Detection Patent Application (Application #20130300058 issued November 14, 2013) - Justia Patents Search

I would actually be a little surprised if there weren’t also several more patents pertaining to pinball and physical measurements along similar lines… probably even conflicting ones that have yet to be either implemented as intended or challenged by others. Sad, but just the reality of things.

I’m torn on this. My initial reaction is to stick to the old way. Cheap, very reliable. OTOH, all too often, improperly set tilts are reported here and elsewhere. Even at big events. Setting a tilt properly is more art than science. Title, type of game (EM or SS), even the type of floor the game is on makes a difference when setting tilts.

I’d like to see some experimentation with digital anyway. By our best players. Keith started changing tilt setting after Stern hired him. I nominate him and Jim Belsito to head up the tilt research committee. Those two guys are the best at setting tilts in my experience.

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I also would love to hear that it is at least being investigated. Imagine how slick it would be for locations to have one of the ‘tournament setting” adjustments be to jump between normal/rando tilt settings and tourney-settings.

Not that it is so difficult to raise the bob and possibly drop in an earplug, etc. but it is easy to forget to return all the games back to ‘normal’ when it starts getting late… and random players tend to get pretty testy when the tilt settings are sensitive and don’t understand the entire why of it.

I think that was just adding an setting to set the de bounce time vs useing an fixed time?
also coin door disable tilt setting
Now they can add more like an debounce time from player to player to cut down an tilt throughs (may be in their but not an setting)

I think this is something pinball doesn’t need.

At what point are we playing a physical game, and at what point are we trying to modernize it where we don’t need to?

Let the physics and imperfection be. The ball is wild. If you want consistency play video games where the variables are more controlled.

I think most of us, including OP, are talking about it within the context of the sport, not the overall hobby.

Accelerometers are cheap now and while old school tilts are cheap too, they can’t be set precisely. If someone can put together a hardware package that would connect to Stern or JJP games, I’m sure we could find some volunteers to try it. Not trying to change the hobby, just trying to find tune the sport.

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just hooking up to an switch that is very easy

You’re going to need an accelerometer mounted solidly and power for the accelerometer. Accelerometer is the new switch. Going to need some logic to read accelerometer and talk to switch matrix too, that’s going to be the hard part.

What I wanted this for was streaming. I think it would be amazing to see a visualization of the force top players are applying to the machine.