Drop Catches - well-timed flip, or well-timed release?

[Bdiv4life]

In my experience, whenever the ball approaches from the opposite angle of your flippers (looking at the drawing, from the left orbit) it’s safer to drop catch. Once it’s past the perpendicular angle and coming from the right orbit, you’re better off live catching, or risk draining if miss-timing the drop catch.

[cayle]

There are different reasons and times to use a flip-catch, or a drop-catch as some people have touched on. Its not one or the other is better. Both are good to have in your toolbox.

Of course, live catches destroy them both

[michi]

@cayle

Of course, live catches destroy them both

Spoken by someone who is unusually good a live catches…

[MattyF]

@ryanwanger

I could be totally wrong, but it seems to me that including the flip adds a lot of extra steps…and each step is an opportunity to for the timing to be slightly off…meaning it should be more difficult to get it just right.

A well timed flip: decide to press button -> flipper goes up -> flipper stops at the top of the flip -> flipper returns to rest.

A well timed release: decide to let go of flipper -> flipper returns to rest.

I think the impetus behind using a timed flip is that the flipper will lose it’s strength at some point on the up-stroke before it hits its apex (provided you don’t hold the button down too long) . Thus you now have a fraction of the up-stroke and the entire down-stroke in which the flipper will be able to damp the ball velocity, rather than just the down-stroke.

Personally, I use both. As Cayle said, I think there are merits to each. Look, for example, at scoop kick-outs such as the Mystery scoop on Metallica, or the Gold Rush scoop on Whitewater. Often I’ll use a quick release of the flipper when I hear the ball kick out in order to get a catch from those. However, on the Whitewater I play right now in particular, that typically just makes the ball bounce off the tip of the flipper and drain. A light tap of the flipper, creating a “well timed flip” is what I use to catch the ball more consistently.

[ryanwanger]

@MattyF

hus you now have a fraction of the up-stroke and the entire down-stroke in which the flipper will be able to damp the ball velocity, rather than just the down-stroke.

Interesting…

There could be something to that.

[Law]

During my undergrad I built a little rig to test button press/release timing. In general people are way faster and more accurate releasing a button in response to stimuli than pressing a button, even if their finger is already on the button. I don’t have the numbers anymore but it was something like an order of magnitude on the abductive movement- basically people are way faster with the “get my hand off this thing” response. Now I’m wondering if serious pinball players have trained enough to overcome or reverse this trend.

Also, if you want to work on your drop catches, shameless plug:

Wizard - Multimorphic, Inc

[ryanwanger]

@Law

In general people are way faster and more accurate releasing a button in response to stimuli than pressing a button, even if their finger is already on the button. I don’t have the numbers anymore but it was something like an order of magnitude on the abductive movement- basically people are way faster with the “get my hand off this thing” response.

This is fascinating.

It wouldn’t be hard to switch out normally open flipper switches for normally closed ones. Then you would flip by releasing the buttons. See how much more accurate you are, and then lament that you’ll never be able to play that way in a competition setting!

[WWJ]

I’ve played a machine with the flippers reversed like this (release to flip) It is even harder to get accustomed to than left/right reverse flippers (Mass Hysteria on GB or Mystery Tour on TSPP). Mainly because you don’t have the option of crossing your arms to adapt.

[pinballguru]

@Bdiv4life

In my experience, whenever the ball approaches from the opposite angle of your flippers (looking at the drawing, from the left orbit) it’s safer to drop catch. Once it’s past the perpendicular angle and coming from the right orbit, you’re better off live catching, or risk draining if miss-timing the drop catch.

Yes, depending on ball speed and angle to the flipper. (on the drawing above). The right arrows coming from a left to right orbit is difficult to drop catch since the ball is traveling so fast. A “Live Catch” is also difficult, but a lot less risky. On games that have such an orbit shot, I experiment and see what the result of a dead flip is.

For example on KISS Pro that I play, if you dead flip that shot, the ball bounces all of the way up to the KISS standups and you rarely lost the ball. Especially helpful if you only need one letter in KISS.