This shows the examples of Lewis and Bowen regarding imbalance didn’t prove anything. Bowen played in 4 events and qualified 10th for SPC. Lewis played in 7 and qualified 47th (play better).
I don’t know how to calculate that outside of doing it manually (which I’m not going to do) 
Paging @Shep for help if he has a query for this.
Wow. That did change quite a bit. Thanks for looking into that.
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I have a question: Is the move from 40 to 20 players related at all to ESPN prep? Aka did espn film and interview the top 10 or 20 expecting them to be in most of the final footage, to show vingettes etc? And then their footage was rendered moot when the 29th seed won it? How much is ESPN factored into this specifically?
IMHO ESPN is not a vanguard of sports entertainment anymore. It’s not profitable and is a drag on Disney. It doesn’t support asymmetric sports coverage for long running events like esports and pinball. And the major sports it covers while profitable now, are in decline (baseball especially). We should be continuing to carve our own way instead of trying to fit a format designed for baby boomers and that probably won’t exist in 20 years.
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ESPN had absolutely nothing to do with these changes, full stop.
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Josh, that’s a weird statement given the press release specifically mentions them.
Is this more in the vein of “we’ve gotten a lot of feedback that pinball is confusing, so we sat down and figured out the best way to make it not confusing is to have less qualifiers.”?
If so, who’s “we” in that statement?
“We” is the management group at Stern along with PAPA management and myself representing IFPA management.
Seeing the drama that this format has already provided in the past when it was 20 qualifiers, and how the “regular season” actually bled into how it impacted the ladder was something we all wanted to get back to.
If there was ever an event where we’ll be constantly experimenting with the format, tweaking this, changing that … it’s going to be the SPC. If a company wanted to sponsor the finals for $1,000,000 and wanted all games to be timed games, it’s something we would seriously discuss between the 3 parties.
This has been and always will be about doing whatever it takes to bring serious outside attention and serious dollars to the SPC. I strongly feel the rest of the competitive pinball landscape will indirectly benefit from all of it.
I can speak for the entire SPC team that we’re not afraid to take some chances on this thing, see where it takes us, and continue to pivot and evolve as things move forward through next season, and 3 seasons after that, and 10 seasons after that.
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Just catching this thread after tpf, our league had been using this for years, it was fun and generally well liked. “Don’t get last” is easy to message and people like the feel of climbing the ladder.
We moved away from it recently because it’s too much of an advantage for the top/most consistent players, the field was getting discouraged. We’re trying to make it easier for less consistent players to have a shot once in a while. It’s also very different when you’re playing in a location where games don’t change much and everyone has time to practice picks exhaustively.
I’m really looking forward to seeing it play out on well set up games in a high level event.
I really wish there was an ability for the top 250 players to have at least 5 auto invites to Stern Circuit events. Sometimes you can’t even get into one of these tournaments and get the necessary points to actually get to the Stern Circuit. Have you ever thought about the ability for players to be able to declare their x number of tournaments so they can get a chance at competing in the event. Not only do you have to be good at pinball but you have to be lucky to actually get into some of these events which should not be the case. You want the best then make it fair for the best players to have access to the tournaments they want to compete in.
Can you elaborate on this?
Are you suggesting, for example, that there be a list of people interested in playing in the 24 Hour Battle and those players get assigned to play in that tournament? I’m honestly asking, because I’m not sure I understand your suggestion at all.
What I am saying is that the top players need to access to Stern Events in order to actually qualify Stern Circuit. There are some events that sellout very quickly and there should be an option for the top players (pick your criteria, top 25, top 50, top 100) to have automatic entry to x amount of limited entry tournaments. A player needs to declare by x date each year. You want the top players to play in Stern Circuit but some of us aren’t even able to compete in them because we don’t hit the button fast enough.
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Sorry Wayne but LOL nobody but nobody wants to watch 40 players get their best score on ten of freaking anything let alone pinball machines - viewers want to watch competition - live- and that is players fighting it out… although I doubt this change would make any TV company care two hoots!
Keith is right that the education level for the average punter for pinball is way too steep, so something that keeps it simple is super important. [$day job is svp technology for BT Sport and ESPN UK]
Pinball wants tv coverage? Then simplify it, make everyone play one machine, build a stats and analytics database (that covers bad performance as well as good) take those who run the events out of playing the events (this is critical for big sponsors).
In my view though it won’t happen, there aren’t enough punters who want to buy KME-engraved pinballs, or Sharpe Rubbers, Bowen laser bulbs, Rosa jackpot lights etc. The pinball market must be $100M industry in total, we pay £9M for a premier league match powered by selling oodles of sponsored stuff and crammed with elite hero’s in the simplest of games.
Cheers,
Neil.
What specific “cute” game selections has TPF made recently (within the last four years)?
What is your definition of “cute?” And what makes TPF (+ among others) cuter than other Circuit events?
What are the drawbacks to having events that require a wide range of skills?
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Yeah, I thought INDISC was the poster child for “cute” game selection?
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I think there may be some validity in the suggestion that we examine the number of limited-person events. Currently, events are selected based on the highest average WPPR point value. This is the most objective way we have to select the “best” events - how many top level players are willing to attend this event? The PAPA Circuit used to try to use subjective data - how was the event rated by players? is there enough geographical difference? - and people shit all over it so this is what we now do. If you have a better suggestion on how to pick events, we’d love to hear and consider it.
Last year, out of 20 events, 8 of them had limited spots (IFPA Pin-Masters, Texas Pinball Festival, Cactus Jack’s Silverball Showdown, Pinburgh, CalEx, Danish Pinball Open, 24 Hour Final Battle at the Sanctum, City Champ). This year, out of 20 events, 7 of them have limited spots (IFPA Pin-Masters, Texas Pinball Festival, City Champ, Pinburgh, 24 Hour Final Battle at the Sanctum, Danish Pinball Open, Bat City).
So 35% of the tournaments have a cap on the number of participants. They each have different caps, based on what their location, organizers, and volunteers can handle. Beyond this preliminary data, I do not have the bandwidth to dig in and figure out how many of the top 250 players were in these, how high they placed, how that affected the position on the SPC, etc. etc. etc… Be my guest.
As for the philosophy of guaranteeing a spot for top players, I can only speak for Pinburgh. Our view has always been to not do that. The tournament is specifically set up in a manner that you (the Royal You) can play against and beat the best in the world. Can you play High Hand? Because Josh can’t. No one knew what Doodle Bug was before it was on the Pinburgh stage in 2016.
I know people who don’t play in anything but Pinburgh.
There are 1000 spots in Pinburgh this year. Of the top 300 WPPR ranked players, 123 are in Pinburgh. I think that’s a pretty good showing. But we can take 1000 people, and other tournaments can’t. I would hate to be in a position to tell Jim at The Sanctum “hey, everyone really loves your tournament, but to be on the SPC you need to take 200 more players.”
We’ll absolutely listen to and consider suggestions, based on data. Like I said above, this is about as deep as I have time to dig. Feel free to work out your figures and present them to @pinwizj . I promise you we’ll give it thought.
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You’ve obviously completely misunderstood
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Somewhat absurd reactions that I have already ranted about in other places aside, the true first thing I said to this was “huh, I guess I’m going to another event or two this year.” We can go back and forth over the logistics (and it’s great discussion to come up with plans and improvements!), but at the end of the day it’s a change in the circuit qualifying metagame that we’re not going to change until 2020 and have to adapt to it for now.
If there’s key metrics that fall off (circuit participation, public optics, etc) because of the change, I’m sure something will be done to rectify it and the discussions and input we see here will definitely provide some great suggestions towards a better solution.
(I don’t speak for PAPA with any of my statements, they don’t let me in the door as long as I’m trying to live the circuit dream)
Working on it - I hope to make the No-Pinburgh top 20 a reality this year (with @bkerins and if he wants to @phendricks as well) Already got a fair start on it! 
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After speaking with a few people this weekend at TPF, the Bat City Open may not be limited this year. I fully plan on having more detailed information in the next week or so now that TPF is over and my TD’s will have time to get to work on Bat City with me.
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I’m pretty much in the “IFPA rankings are for people seeking validation for quarter pumping” camp, but is there a good reason why we can’t just increase the number of “important” events? NWPAS had an issue a few years ago, and Shorty’s is a bit advantageous to people who play there a lot, and 4/20 at Add A Ball is a goat kicking spectacle of insanity, but all of those are more prestigious to local players than NW Champs. Like is 4/20 automatically disqualified because they occasionally release live goats, and you kind of have to play around the live goats? Because I felt like the goats made me better.
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